Redistribution ....

Do you believe our founding documents allow for redistribution of wealth ?

 

No more than the corporate elite are allowed to exploit, rape and pilfer, or legally claim that they are a "person" with all the rights afforded a "person", yet function as a corporation.

 

What do you believe in ?

You live in a Democratic Republic that has lived on the Capitalistic way for 200 + years. Maybe you are part of a company, and work for one of those large corporations, or maybe you own a small company, or are employed by one.
Are the changes you want, bigger government to reign in all these capitalists ? More things handed to you , more restrictions . Your part of the pie you deserve ?
Or is it Smaller government with fewer restrictions and a congress that can not be bought by K st.A president who takes a stand and means what he says. One who can cash a check with his A$$ that he wrote with his mouth ?
The later is what our Constitution is about,and our Declaration of Independence. Is that what you want ?
Read them ! They are on the White House . gov site for now.

 

All I know is I have been hearing the standard "lower taxes for business" and "government get out of the way" lines from the right since I was a kid. What I have seen, through my life's experiences, is corporations taking over other companies (which ALWAYS leads to massive job cuts, CEO bonuses), and the people left with a job wind up doing the work of 2 or 3 people, usually with no raises, sometimes pay cuts, always benefit cuts, along with the almost continual conveyed threat of "don't complain too much or we'll find somebody else" attitude...AND THEY WILL., because there are so many other victims of corporate rape to employ. Meanwhile, while we're hearing of stock prices for said company "projected" to do very well, the "Joe six pack" falls deeper and deeper into debt, multiple jobs required to "keep up" (like that's even possible), home values plummet, grocery prices go up and up, and on and on. Then., more companies merge, rape and pilfer while the stuffed shirts stick their hands out for bailouts...but want government out of their business. That has been my life experiences with "corporate America", with the right barking out the same old song and dance. I've heard it over and over and over. Nothing at all new. And what can you do except "bend over"? Meanwhile it's all the liberals fault. All the while, the right offers us all Sarah Palin and George Bush while they spew their capitalist "just take care of the rich and we'll all be ok" horse s***" and bash the left for all the greed and war mongering policies. Makes me gag.

 

Pep what brought about the latest finacial crisis? Lack of proper goverment restrictions and blatant corporate greed. Is that what you wish for but on a larger scale?
Please do not tell me that corporations can act in a manner that limits the profit motive because they can not, they are motivated by shareholders only and that equals profit 1st.
Now when your country formed it's constitution just how many global corporations were there in America?
I can understand deregulation working for the small buissness but the big boy's need to be watched, after all you talk about buying congress etc, who exactly do you thing is doing the buying? Big Corporations yet at the same time you want to give them more freedom!!

 

You guys with your logic. Very funny.

 

I find your logic regarding corporatism to be hilarious as well.

 

Greed from Administrations. When they could not get enough brown envelops they started to look who else had money , the rest of America. Give them less for more. Spend and print money and kill the dollars in their accounts.Take new taxes and redistribute the funds .
Corporate profit lies in their ability to not only have good products but be able to get by some laws that help the bottom line. That coupled with the worlds top productivity and lots of money is made for all in the loop.
Freedom is what makes us great and why people come to America.
Corporations work the system and pay for lobbists to show Congress it is in their best interest to take those brown envelopes.
We were promised time and time again their would be no more lobbying Congress , it has never happened.
Now to make it more interesting you have Business, Congress and the Executive branch all wanting more !
We are by all accounting standards broke ! We do have a whole lot of natural resources that some countries would love to buy, but we can not seem to be able to sell them to our own citizens. We purchase from out side interests.
With health care, cap& screw , and a host of other bills in the hopper people become more dependent on large government.
Small business is getting the Axe straight up. Easier to control a fewer number of corporations than a whole bunch of small businesses also.
It appears that if this is not halted we will lose a lot of freedom for much of nothing. A takeover of America and a reditribution of the forward looking wealth we create. A world economy is not our way !
I am not sure this will fly with even the people who have never seen what happens in these situations.
When America gets really upset they have a way of making a point.

Pep

 

Man...I'm looking for something to disagree with and I ain't seein' it. Must be something in my eyes.
I would add that "people" looking for freedom coming to America is a good thing. Corporations aren't what the founding fathers had in mind though, I don't think, nor are corporations having the same legal rights as a "person", commiting corporate acts, and accountable to only it's stockholders. Something wrong with that picture.

 

Your can't have employees without EMPLOYERS first and foremost.

Somebody has the idea, somebody has the will, somebody takes the risk, somebody works harder and longer, somebody makes smart decisions and those are the people that eventually hire others (employees) who have no problem working as little as they can for as much dollars as they can enjoy.

You cannot tax yourself into prosperity as B.O. believes. According to the IRS, the top 50% of all wage earners already pay over 98% of all taxes collected. For the liberal socialists out there . . . how much more do you want??? 60%, 70%, 80% or do you want it all???

You may collect all of one's earnings for year one, but how many people are going to work for NOTHING for year 2 and onward?? Would you? Be honest...would you work for nothing? How about if the government takes 90% of your earniing? Would you be motivated to create a business with that much regulation and taxes?

If you focus on increasing tax revenues by encouraging captialism and business ownership instead of thinking that raising taxes again, and again, and again, etc. on the producers is going to help the fed's coffers to pay for endless govvernment programs instead of more employers that leads to more employees (that is NEW tax payers too)...it will work.

It worked for Kennedy, it worked for Reagan and it worked for Bush II.

History is clear on this...

 

Sounds like Americans want America back ! Wanting is not enough you have to make statements with votes, money , staying as a group, being larger then those we hired to do what we ultimately have to do ourselves. We are learning ,we have to be part or all of the solution ,they are they problem !

 

Corporates have one single motto Pep make money, NOW! they produce cheaply and sell high as the market will take, they realy dont care about the guy who works for them if they can get labour cheaper then they move. Small buisness now that is different, they deserve all the breaks they can get and are normaly in a community for the long haul.
Unfortunatly we live in a consumer based society and when your founding fathers wrote the constitution they lived in a largly agricultural society a big difference in perspectives.
Who exactly do you want to give tax breaks to? The Bankers? Car Manufacturers, Computer makers? or the guy who will fix your leaking roof or the owner of a small factory who can use it to hire a couple of local extra guy's? and pass on the reduction in his costs to you?
Now you say the corporations give out the brown envelopes etc, yet in the same breath ask for less regulations to govern them!!

 

Tell me

You tell me who you think should pay what ?
What is " Free " from tax by our collective work.
How has your system worked for you. Really !
You have crossed this path . What worked and what did not.
Do you have freedom to excess, enough, not enough.
Are you taxed beyond your ability to pay. Does Parliament work on ways to get your last pound.
One person can add a little to all our knowledge base.
We see what we have, but really do not see anything but what we are told. Reading fiction is probably closer to the truth in America.
As we have seen food and water might be the real currency
going forward.
Tell us about Great Britain !

 

Good stuff..

 

What we ar about.

This is a simple little movie that shows why we picked the type of orginal government.
What we are about is the following.

http://www.wimp.com/thegovernment/



Pep

 

Well Pep one of the big diffrences is we do not simply have a 2 party state which you do, and at the moment our political system is going through major changes regarding the way MP's opporate and the accountability of them. so to be honest you can not realy compare the two systems fairly, yours has much to be admired but to be honest is way to rigid. Ours is more flexable but again been honest is not open enough (At the moment) nor do we have a written constitution which I think is wrong.
Now I am not sure what you mean by asking what is free from tax as that realy had nothing to do with what I was talking about!!
Now over here these items are free from tax

food
books, newspapers and magazines
children's clothes
Plus Drugs, medicines, aids for disabled people.
other items are taxed at a lower rate to the standard 15%

Income tax is as follows

0 - £37,400 20 per cent (basic rate)
Over £37,400 40 per cent (higher rate)

Then we have a council tax which will depend on the type of home you live in and can differ widely

Finaly we have National Insurance this you pay from the day you start work, it covers your health care state pension etc
This startts at 11% of your wage if you earn above £110 per week up to £844 per week (£5280/£40512 per year) above this you pay a extra 1%

If you are self employed the rate is different

Hope that helps

 

So in actuality the tax is lower than ours because you get a lot more for your tax dollar. Interesting. Our tax system is structured differently. If you're an averge Joe, you pay taxes. If you're rich, you can hide your money to effectivey pay no real taxes, and you get tax writeoffs galore. I guess that's why everyone wants to be rich or in politics.

 

Is that 11% just for the National Insurance?

If our proposed system was more honest, that is what we would do too. Instead of pretending we are going to pay for a lot of it in other ways.

 

Well Stu that 11% was SUPPOSE to be simply for NI but of course goverments been goverments actualy spent it on other things , due to this policy they have come close to bankrupting the pension fund so have to now up the retierment age !!

 

The difference is that wages are taxed, not consumption and not wealth (which is why there was such a row a year or so ago when Warren Buffett announced his secretary was being taxed at a 39% rate & he at only 17%). The liberal elite have such wealth accumulated that they have no qualms whatsoever at raising taxes on wages- they aren't effected nearly as bad as us "average joes" nor are the people who will support higher taxes- those who pay no taxes anyway because they live off of government entitlements (and I'm not talking about retirees who do get taxed to death).
TAX CONSUMPTION!!
As far as corporations & other businesses go, the more attractive the business climate , the more likely they are to locate in your area, the more jobs they will create & the nore wages they can pay....over the long haul. I understand that it's cool to bash big business these days but look what happens when they fail- jobs are lost & the economy suffers. I'll clue you in on something, every business in every city in every state in every country in the history of the world is in it to profit...and profit huge. That is why they invest and that is how they can continue in business. Don't hate them because they profit, appreciate them for giving you a job and allowing you to put food on the table & a roof over your head! Where would any of you be without "business"? I grew up on a farm. Without the company I went to work for after college, I would probably still be there. It's fun on the weekends but I wouldn't want to have to go back to doing it for a living. Who would I sell the milk & crops to if a business wasn't buying it from me? Where would I find the time to farm & retail my produce?
Sure businesses can be heartless & poor corporate citizens but do they really owe you anything more than a wage (that you agree to work for) for the job that you have agreed to perform?
There's a lot of crying, bellyaching & casting blame around here. Maybe it's time to sit back & re-evaluate reality.