Well, I for one, am shocked ....Pentagon officials undercut the intelligence community in the run-up to the U.S. invasion of Iraq by insisting in briefings to the White House that there was a clear relationship between Saddam Hussein and al-Qaida, the Defense Department's inspector general said Friday.... Time to start backpedalling boys. :headbang:
Need I remind you... http://www.cointalk.org/showthread.php?t=20400&page=2&highlight=disgruntled ... the weapons were moved into the Bekaa Valley before the invasion and are currently still buried in Syria. The operations side of the house has them targeted...
Need I point out that the pre-war intel that was manipulated was the Saddam Hussein and al-Qaida connection and this thread has nothing to do with WMD's. Did you even read the topic? Here it is again... Try to keep up Bone.
I really don't pay attention to the news except to see when or where natural disasters occur. As far as political intrigue anything which can be twisted by the media or either the Far Right or the Far Left is going to look distorted and folks won't get a clear picture of reality. I'm a realist and can say with certanity, "The USA is in this for the long haul, the War On Terror/Radical Islam is going to last over 100 years so you'd better get comfortable..."
The twisting in this case was done by none other than yours and my dear old pentagon headed by...you guessed it, Donald Rumsfeld. Neocons are finally being flushed into the light of day for the arrogance and stupidity that they inflicted on the citizens of this country. They should be flogged, beaten, hanged, shot, and fed to wild dogs for their treason, not rewarded with cushy jobs in the private sector. :stooge: This is going to be a long fight. Lets hope we do better in the next round. encil:
GREAT IDEA, You must talking about all those nuts who call the UNITED STATES of AMERICA such a criminal nation yet enjoy the freedoms she provides and reside in it. The very ones who come up with nutty ideas which undermine National Policy and put military members fighting a war (which protects their right to say these stupid things) at risk by emboldening terrorists who would make Our Nation just another camel souk...
There are an infinite number of ways to abuse the freedoms of this country. Our current National Policy as you call it, is just another example of the abuse of the freedoms this country that our forefathers provided. The old stale argument that to question failed policies is somehow an abuse of the freedoms that we are guaranteed anyway has been discredited as merely a diversionary tactic of the past. To not question an out of control and tyrannical regime is not only cowardly lemming-like behavior but it also endangers the very freedoms this country stands for. If anyone abuses the power of their elected office, they should be held accountable not receive support from partisan political factions like brainless zombies mumbling BUSH! BUSH! BUSH! Maybe that kind of argument works on military recruits during basic training when they are not allowed to question any policies but the rest of us have the constitutionally guaranteed right to question any policy that we disagree with especially if done in the name of our country. And NO, the military did not give us these freedoms, but they do often take credit for them. The military is merely one tool in the arsenal that a country has to rely on when dealing with other countries and if recent history is any indication, not a very effective one.
Are you Adam Gadahn? And is this babble backed up by numbers? If so they are probably like those in the GreenHouse poll... Hmmm, pretty foolish thing to say, but saved for posterity never-the-less. Oh Adam do something useful. Go pickett a funeral or something like that...
There is one thing that is NOT disputable...no matter how you may wish to spin it: There are MILLIONS and MILLIONS and MILLIONS of "true" mulsims that are not threatening, but they are PROMISING to kill and destroy us infidels. Iraq and Afghanistan are the front lines in this war against "true" muslims and I am VERY grateful that our military can kill these animals THERE then waiting for these animals to kill us HERE. If we have to kill these "true" muslims is Syria and Iran as well who are supplying "insurgents", weapons, and money into Iraq, so be it...they need to be killed as well. One thing Bush made very clear back in 2001, this will a war like nothing the United States has fought before. It will not be about divisions of men going up against divisions of the enemy. We are fighting an animal that shoots behind the cover of woman and children and if questionsed, they will lie and tell you "islam is a religion of peace". The worse part is that these muslims relish death over life and have no fear of dying...especially since the award is 72 virgins and eternal muslim paradise. Come on! Are you really surprised that these muslim animals are acting as they do!?!? 1,400 years of islamic jihad, their founding pedophile prophet, their actions, their deeds, their culture, and of course, their book of hate, the koran ALL prove that we must kill these animals as quickly as possible. Kill or be killed...we didn't start thier jihad, but we better finish it on OUR terms, not theirs!
http://www.cointalk.org/showthread.php?t=16618 Moen1305, did say it best. I've got to give credit where credit is due...
boy oh boy! Sounds as if we got up on the wrong side of the tent this morning, now doesn't it? We meed a little more time kneeling, facing the east!:bow: :bow: :bow:
Do your best to divert the topic to this Gadahn guy or Muslims, WMD's, or whatever, but you can't change the fact that the pentagon under Bush/Rumsfeld lied, manipulated and took this country to war under false pretenses. Over 3000 American soldiers have already died because of that lie and if that doesn't make a veteran angry, I can't say I'd relish the thought of being next to that former soldier in time of war. I believe that if my nextdoor neighbor goes to war, he or she better have leaders that honor his or her commitment enough to not throw their lives away on a trumped up war. By your avoidance of the issue, you obviously don't care about the reasons behind the policies and would easily toss your fellow brothers into harms way without so much as a good reason for doing so. Is this your own personal version of honor? Go picket a funeral you say...I rather go picket a VFW with live people that are only dead from the neck up. Fallen soldiers are summarily dishonored by their fellow soldiers when those soldier support an unjust war. I think as nutty as those people in Kansas are, they have nothing on those that have served and not bothered to become educated enough to move beyond blind patriotism. Go ahead, change the subject now if this one makes you too uncomfortable.
Well that's because me and several others in this forum have been extolling this position all along and when the inspector general comes out and says that we were spot on the nose with our assertions, it tends to make one a little grumpy that so many others here can still deny the reality of the situation with utter smugness. There never were al- Qaida terrorists in Iraq before the war but there are terrorists there now thanks to failed policies, inept leadership, and manipulated intelligence that determined a course of action and then sought to make the facts fit the outcome. How "bass-ackwards" can this cadre of fools be? Like I said before, Muslim terrorists 1 United States 0 Wise up boys or get the H*** out of the way! :headbang: :headbang: :headbang:
You go ahead, "Good Luck with that." These are my last words on this thread. One must remember never to argue with an idiot. They'll drag you down to their level and beat you up with experience dd: :mouth:
An out of context quote that had nothing whatsoever to do with Iraq. It was a reference to the Hesbola fighters fighting Israeli soldiers. I'd say that the Iraqi insurgents are pretty good at what they are doing. Not that they don't hide among civilians but they have the American military hiding behind walled compounds for the most part. But try again to change the subject that makes you feel uncomfortable. :rolling:
Bail out like the coward you've proven you are and never address the issue. You can't argue with my assertions so you try to change the subject again and again and then bail when you are called on your tactics. Shame on you. I do respect some veterans, just not all of them. :hatch:
History has clearly demonstrated that perpetual warfare is incompatible with a free society -- they are fire and water. It has been suggested here that we will be at war for 100 years, and that there are "millions and millions..." of enemies that need to be exterminated. Anyone who accepts this, and can't think of any way to avoid these outcomes must also accept the end of the American Republic and its transformation into something else. There is no other possible outcome. Be careful with the choices you make, and realize that choices and actions have consequences. If you determine that we can't avoid such a struggle because our enemies will not allow it, they have already won because the way of life and the nation that all of the patriots who came before us worked for will be gone.
I'd strengthen that comment by saying that we have not only the right, but the DUTY to question the policies of our government... the government OF the people BY the people and FOR the people... whe they run counter to the expressed principles of our constitution. What is a patriot? Is it the person who declares "My country, right or wrong!" and proceeds to support any propaganda put out by the administration in power, no matter what? Or is it the person who says "My country, make it right!" and proceeds to use all their power to counter the forces that would cause our country to do wrong things? Were the gunners of the My Lai massacre patriots because they "followed orders" and shot dozens of unarmed Vietnamese women and children in cold blood? Or was Hugh Thompson the patriot, because he disobeyed orders and set his chopper down in front of those men and stopped the massacre? Which act took greater courage? Which stood up for the principles upon which our country was founded? It is a crude and unbefitting tactic of the lower sort of "conservative" opiners to tell critics of our government policies "Why don't you move to Europe then if you like it so much?" The correct answer is: "Because I love my country too much to leave it in the hands of people like you." In other words, I criticize my government, when and as it seems necessary to me, because it is my DUTY as a citizen to do so. We've butted heads on some issues Cloudsweeper, but I'm totally with you on this one. We have to find a better solution than a hundred years war.
My thoughts exactly. But some don't want to hear this side of patriotism because like Pascal's wager claims, We want to be deceived, well some of us anyway. It makes it easier to live your life if you believe in the deceit rather than the truth. I think Pascal was talking about a certain type of Republican.
Thank you TOM!! It is our DUTY to question our government. I question everything, and don't accept any explanation they feed us, just because they're in charge. I like the Thomas Jefferson quote: something about how from time to time the tree of liberty should be refreshed by the blood of patriots and tyrants. I know I just butchered that quote, so feel free to correct it. Anyway, point is, if you buy everything the government says, like the older generation was raised to do, your going against what the founding fathers beleived in and practiced in their time.
