Let's talk about farm/agriculture subsidies

As someone who grew up on a farm & now owns a farm, I would like to hear what some non-farmers think about subsidies. I have participated in a few programs over the years but I have also seen a lot of waste & stupidity on behalf of both federal & local agencies.

 

It is the antithesis of a free market. It is nothing more than welfare with a fancy name.

 

I defer to those with more knowledge on the subject lol

 

It is easy to understand. It is just redistribution of your income to either some farmer or some farm conglomerate. If they want handouts, they can go talk to Willie Nelson.

 

Well it is simply another form of Bailout is it not? and one that has been going on for a very long time

 

This seems to be the common misperception. In reality, it is a business proposition from the gov't to the farmer. The gov't is asking the farmer to do something they otherwise wouldn't do with their farmland. In my case, I was approached to grow prickly pear cactus. The gov't is studying the potential use of prickly pair cactus as an energy crop and it isn't feasible to for them to conduct the type of study they wish to do themselves. The gov't is paying me a subsidy to grow these plants.

 

Misconception. lol You will have to pardon me if I don't take the rationalizations of someone sucking on the government farm subsidy teet as seeing the issue for what it really is.

And I really want to thank the government for taking my money and giving it to you to grow something I have no interest in. Great deal there. Prickly pear cactus. Good Lord. If it wasn't actually welfare, some private company would be paying you for that boondoggle, errrr research, not taxpayers. That is how the market works.

That's like giving my money to some farmer not to grow some crop so prices stay high. Or giving my money to some farmer for his chickens and then giving the chickens away to ensure the price doesn't decrease to true market value. Or giving my money to some farmer to ensure he makes more income on his crops by promising him a manipulated price for his goods. Great deals all around.

Rationalize it all you want. It is just welfare, market manipulation and redistribution of income. I would rather decide where my money goes than give it to some farmer for growing prickly pear cactus, thank you very much. It is nothing more than socialism and it is 15 to 20 billion per year that can be cut immediately.

 

What part of what I described don't you understand? The gov't wants to study this crop as a potential energy source but can't feasibly do it on their own. I was approached & agreed to be part of it if the price was right. Well, the price was right. If I wasn't being paid for this do you think I (or anyone else) would agree to turn over a portion of my land.
Ignorance of the subject is understandable though as both parties have made a habit of painting all subsidies as payment for doing nothing.

 

That is not a subsidy David that is paying you to carry out a operation for them

A subsidy (also known as a subvention) is a form of financial assistance paid to a business or economic sector. Most subsidies are made by the government to producers or distributors in an industry to prevent the decline of that industry (e.g., as a result of continuous unprofitable operations) or an increase in the prices of its products or simply to encourage it to hire more labor (as in the case of a wage subsidy). Examples are subsidies to encourage the sale of exports; subsidies on some foods to keep down the cost of living, especially in urban areas; and subsidies to encourage the expansion of farm production and achieve self-reliance in food production.

 

How fast do you think rural America would turn on the Corpora-Cons if they ended farm subsidies? Now that corporate farming owns everything from the patents on the seeds to the majority of the land, it's just a matter of time before family farms are unimportant to the Corpora-Cons and the subsidies will end and family farms with have to sell their remaining assets to the big guys. Paying people not to grow crops is not what you'd call the free market. It has kept many small inefficient farms afloat long after they should have been history. But these are the people that whine the loudest about welfare, socialism, and the government.

 

Exactly was I was thinking but David isn't the sharpest tool when he walks into his shed either.

 

How interesting. Would not care to back that up, would you? Try;

OOPS!

 

Well, I receive the funds through the federal farm subsidy program.....so now what?

 

Still not a subsidy though if you are simply growing something for the Goverment and not them giving you funds to keep on growing a existing crop
Prior to this did you grow the same crop to sell on the open market and if so has the price droped to a point were it is no longer economicaly viable for you to continue, is the goverment cash to cover your shortfall?
Or is it the case that the goverment came to you and asked that you raise a crop for a specified purpose such as bio fuel testing or GM testing?

 

Sorry, I can't excuse your ignorance just because your government handouts have clouded your rational conservative thinking. I can understand it but I don't excuse it. Using my tax dollars to pay you for something the private market is not interested in paying for themselves is the exact opposite of a free market and capitalism. Let's pay all the welfare folks to make paper airplanes and call it a Future Aerospace Technology Study and there will be no more welfare. Gimme a break.

They are obviously giving him more money for growing some stupid cactus than he would get if he farmed a real crop to bring to a real market to sell to real buyers otherwise he would be an idiot to be doing it. And obviously the private sector should be paying him and not the government if it was a real project with real potential. That's a subsidy, welfare, giveaway...whatever you want to call it...using mine and everyone elses' tax dollars.

 

Maybe that's why so many are confused as to how the bureacracy really works?

I had no idea what this crop was prior to being approached by my ag agent....the only 2 things I grow on my farm (other than the gov't pears) are grapes & hay. I sell the grapes to a local winery and I allow my neighbor to cut the hay to feed his cows. No gov't money involved with these two.

 

Oh cut the drama!

Geesh, Do you read before spewing? It's a gov't study! I'm not growing this crop in place of something else, it's on land that would have otherwise sat idle. My farm is more of a weekend getaway. I grow grapes as a hobby & hay as a favor to my neighbor.

 

You are deluding yourself. Why don't you go do some research on the amount of drill-able oil that the private market is being denied the opportunity to develop. Then come back and tell me with a straight face how the Magic Cactus Juice Fuel that Obama is paying our hard earned tax dollars to have some hobbyist farmer grow is not just 'busy work' welfare, a stimulus, a handout, whatever.

And that is better? You weren't going to make any money on it with a real market crop at all so you turned to the taxpayers to bail you out? I was at least giving you a little credit that you would have made money on the land without taking government assistance.

 

Put your listening ears on for a minute. I apologize to everyone for having to repeat this but obviously not everyone here is capable of grasping the issue. It is a hobby farm. I had land that was sitting idle. I had no intention of "making money on a real crop" on the land the gov't is using for their study. Did you miss all of the that the first or second time around? Why wouldn't I help them out? I don't think I ever referred to this crop as "magic" not have any of the gov't people involved. I believe they are merely looking into it as a possible fuel source (the plant has more natural sugar in it than any other, including corn) and are looking into it on a small scale.
On a side note here, stu, your irrational arguing of arbitrary points that aren't germaine reminds me a whole lot of craiga.

 

Oops! No link.