Wisconsin recall?

I understand why you might think that the Wis. Dems leaving the state to keep the legislature from having a quorum was a dirty trick. If I have learned nothing else from academia, I have learned that if you want people to buy into what you are proposing, you have to build a consensus. Not only was there no consensus building regarding stripping union rights, no one had even brought up the subject during the campaign as an issue. Walker did have a majority in the senate but that doesn't give him the right to ignore the other half of the people in the state. He completely cut the Dems out of the process by not allowing debate, by not asking for any input, and by railroading the legislation through without any consideration for the opposition. We aren't a dictatorship in this country, we are a representative demorcacy and those Dems were doing their best to represent their constituents. The Dems were so removed by the process that all they could do was sit and watch or prevent a quorum to force debate. I think that when any political situation comes down to the two tactics both sides used, there is a problem with the system.
But we were actually talking about elections not Parliamentary procedures. The only reason we have a democracy at all is because we are supposed to believe that we have a fair and representative election process that people can trust. When election after election seems to be tainted by dirty tricks and mysterious vote counts from Waukesha County, people begin to believe that the election process is a sham and that their views are not represented. What do you think will happen right after people stop believing in the process? Liberty will be the first casualty. Yours and mine.
BTW I'm not sure what a government union is.

 

What shouldn't amaze me but always does is that these middle class Right-wingers seem to think that they are going to be somehow spared the middle class downgrade the vast majority of us have already been well aware of. I can't figure out why they think that they are special and above the process that is taking down the entire middle class. Any objective look at the situation we as middle class Americans have faced recently would tell anyone that they are about to take a pretty hard hit economically just as we have been taking the last 30 plus years. I suppose they are just happy to blame the Dems anyway they can twist what is going on and that is all they actually care about. If you're miserable anyway, what difference does it make if you are miserable with a 50,000 dollar a year income or a 20,000 dollar a year income, as long as you have somebody else to blame for your troubles. Even if you can't see it is the guys standing right next to you with the sacks full of money.

 

Take that paragraph and substitute BO, Republicans and Obamacare and it sure sounds familiar. The Republicans did not leave the country, but they supported Obamacare every bit a little as the dips were supporting Wisconsin's bill. I realize since this was your ox, you feel slighted and Obamacare was your enemy's ox, you were enjoying the show. However, the only real difference is that Obamacare is going to get ruled unconstitutional.

 

That is exactly what I thought you'd say. I can think of at least 6 Republican ideas that are in
Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act (PPACA) and they are right here: http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2010/02/five_compronises_in_health_car.html The real problem was that Republicans didn't want input of even their own ideas, they wanted no bill at all. That's not a solution.

It took over a year to debate and pass this the PPACA law. No such thing happened in Wisconsin. It was rushed through during the very first state legislator meeting because Walker thought he had been elected king or dictator not governor. Just because you happen to agree with his position doesn't make his methods right. Too bad you can't make that distinction.

 

Yep, it was your ox that got gored in Wisconsin. You are so myopic prejudiced that you cannot even see the similarities between the two.

BTW, they did not need any great discussion. All the Reps agreed and there were not dips to discuss anything with. And it took a year to debate Obamacare was so Pelosi and Reid could get enough dip support to pass the unconstitutional bill.

 

So you're saying con obstructionism OK, Dem obstructionism bad. I guess we can keep it simple.

 

Not in the least. You need to go to a doctor and get your perspective adjusted. However, you definitely have said that dip obstructionism is OK while Republican obstructionism bad.

 

I think with the Government buyout of the banks and with so much of the banks now having Arab oil money invested in them that there was a redistribution of wealth from being in the United States to the Middle East. The whole world is close to fiancial ruin and look what they are building over there. They even have us being their police force be it directly USA or as NATO. I think the USA really means now "Under Saudi Arabia" Now if they can destory the middle class along with family and/or religious values then we not only get weaker morally but also have more people looking for a direction in life and that is where the one hundred million dollars a year investment into building mosques falls into play. Call it crazy but I really think that we are under attack by destorying our way of life to replace it with another be it in ten years or ten decades.

 

Just call it Obamacare. You sound so stuffy when you call it the "Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act" or "PPACA" (Pee-Packa).

 

If you can find the legislation named "Obamacare", I'll start using that name instead.

 

Don't worry about it. It is going to go away in the not too distant future.

 

Now that the figures are coming out, the Republicans spent $15,000,000, but the unions spent $35,000,000. Interesting. They were out spent 2:1, but they won the seats 2:1 and, from the sounds of things, the dip will wind up only gaining one seat.

 

Prove it!

 

http://www.newsmax.com/Headline/fund-walker-wisconsin-recall/2011/08/10/id/406835
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4407705...-recall-vote-high-stakes-battle/#.TkkiUYK_jaI
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...-to-capture-state-senate-in-recall-elections/

 

MSNBC says nothing in this article about who spent how much just that 31 millions was spent. Newsmax say John Fund said that unions spent 35 million but doesn’t explain how he got that number. How could he possibly know since you no longer have to report who gave what? And everyone else is saying the total was 31 million. That makes him just wildly guessing. Fox News says nothing in this article about who spent how much just that 31 millions was spent. Was this your idea of a joke?

 

MediaMatters: Right-wing media have falsely claimed that "unions and left-wing groups" spent roughly $30 million, or have otherwise ignored money spent by conservative groups, to influence the recent Wisconsin recall elections. In fact, about $30 million was reportedly spent by right-wing and left-wing groups combined, "with a slight edge possible to Republicans overall."

 

So you have just proven that you lied here. How very interesting!

 

Here you go:

View attachment 211

 

Sorry, I guess I should have been more specific. A REAL piece of legislation.

 

Huh?