Democrats are bad...

It’s not a matter of which party faithful are wealthier, it is a matter of which party looks out for the interests of the wealthy and which party looks out for the interests of the middle class. The common belief in this country is that Republicans are more concerned about the people that least need looking out for. In other words, the wealthy. No objective person could possibly look at their policies and think otherwise.

 

Sure it is. The dems want to maintain their wealth & power my making sure as few people as possible are able to join their little circle of power, thus entitlements & controls designed to keep people "in their place". The dem elites don't believe wealth is something every person can achieve- if they possess the initiative and aren't limited by government control. They feel their wealth & power is something they must protect from the masses.
Rep policy on the other hand is designed to encourage an equal opportunity to achieve (or fail) and assumes a measure of personal responsibility. I believe that if everyone works hard, makes the right choices & takes responsibility for their own lives we can all achieve the level of wealth we desire.

 

Equal opportunity like giving corporations the same rights as citizens? Equal opportunity like saying money equals free speech? How is that equal opportunity? Believe what you wish. I'll stick to reality.

 

Equal opportunity like encouraging people...expecting people to earn their way rather than convincing them to rely on the government to solve their problems & make their decisions.
Remember, when Hilary was running for prez, and she cited various social programs that were developed during the Clinton administration as examples of her vast experience? Remember she was asked to produce one single solitary success story? One single person who was able to ween themselves from the government dole? Remember the outcome? She couldn't produce a single person and quickly dropped that bit of "experience" from her resume.

I think the bottom line difference is this:
Republican theory says "let me teach you to care for yourself, then you decide what to do with it". Democratic theory says "sit back & let the government take care of you". Kinda like the old adage "Teach a man to fish & he eats for a lifetime, give a man a fish & he eats for a day"? Let's teach everyone to fish rather than have them line-up every day for your handouts.

 

I wonder how many people actually realize the "drill baby drill" mentality will do NOTHING for the world oil market (which his where it will go, lining the pockets of the Bush clones).

 

Those on top of the heap want to maintain the status quo that keeps them at the top and they bend/twist/manipulate public policy to keep themseves there. What the fools in the middle class that support them don't or can't understand is that they are being manipulated by phony rhetoric and false dichotomies that hide the contradictions and lies. That is the crux of why liberals think conservatives are stupid. They can't see what they are doing to themselves and us through their own actions but chose to adhere to meaningless yet highly corrupt ideals. Anytime you get into an argument with one of these supporters and give them facts that contradict their beliefs, they pull back into their shells and chant nonsense until they have erased what they have just heard. Fine, be an idiot, just don't take me down with you.

 

You act as though the Republicans hava a monopoly on this behavior:

The fact that Liberals don't know that left wing politicians are equally as evil as right wingers is why conservatives think liberals are stupid.

 

A. I think anyone is capable of this type of behavior but I find it a little more repugnant when this behavior only justifies the abuse of others.

and...

B. Liberals believe that government can sometimes be the answer while conservatives get elected just to prove the that government is never the answer. Government only works when those running it actually believe in it. Conservative are under the false assumption that the private sector is the only answer to all our problems. Putting power in people hands that you don't elect can never be a good formula for a representative democracy. This is exactly why conservatives slander government and praise private industry. Private industry answers to only small groups of shareholders. Go ahead and weaken your own government to your own peril. See how that works out for you.

 

A. I never used it as an excuse to justify conservatives doing it. I only pointed it out to expose your ignorance or blatant spin tactic.

and

B. Government does not work. Name one government agency that runs as productively or efficiently as an average private sector company. The shareholders you speak of are usually interested in profits and have a vested interest in the financial well being of the company. The same evils that you see in the corporate elite exist in our politicians. Perhaps the reason is because our politicians are the corporate elite.

 

The U.S. Mint! It is not only self-funding, it makes a profit. It costs the tax payer nothing.

BTW Just in case "one" was an insufficient number, here is a much larger list of government agencies that are well run.

http://www.atheistnexus.org/forum/topics/name-one-govt-agency-that-runs?xg_source=activity

 

Nice list from the Athiest site Moen, but let me ask this as an INDY Conservative.....many agencys were pointed out.

Lets look into how many are not on the verge of bankruptcy, how many are ON PROJECTED BUDGETS, and so on. Dont have time now, but immedaitly I cannot think of ANY Gov agency that EVER comes in underbudget and on time. How many are subsidized with tax payer dollars ? If it's GOV, we pay for it. And we always pay more than they " project ".

 

Any list of well run government agencies that includes the post office has to be tongue in cheek. And the branches of the military??? Needed, sure, but well run? For those who don't know how money works in the military, let me relate my 20 year experience.

The AF gets a pot of money. The top bean counters hold back some of that money for emergencies, etc and distribute the rest out as budgets. Now, at the end of Sept, there is money left over. Being that the government is trillions of dollars in debt, you might think that money goes back to pay our bills. Well, it doesn't. Not even close. In fact, none of it does from what I saw each and every year.

There are people working in government agencies at the every end of every single Sept up until midnight of the 30th. Their job is to make sure that money gets spent. Money flows down from that pool that was held back over the year and it is obligated as soon as it arrives at the agency. Can't leave it unspent because the books won't balance and you might not get as much money next year.

Literally weeks of planning goes on to have things ready to spend this money on as soon as it flows down. In my experience, little of it went to real necessities. It was always spent much more like Christmas. Many, many times the word would go out that they were running out of things to spend money on and telling sections to submit more requests.

And I am not talking a hundred dollars here or a thousand dollars there. I am talking hundreds of thousands here and a million or two there. And this was for one hospital - different hospitals over 20 years - but the scenario never varied at the end of year closeouts. Gotta spend it all.

That is the reality of government agencies.

 

Kinda the flip side of corporations, CEO's and the like, who feel they have to "take" it all rather than share the profits. More, more, more. Never enough.
Whether it's the government spending it or the wall street corporate criminals taking it, it is the same. Remember the TRILLIONS that were "missing" from the Pentagon that Rummy announced on 9/10/01? The folks that were investigating this just happened to be in the part of the Pentagon that was blown up the next day. What a coincidence huh?

 

I have said it before but...the government is just a really (really, really) big corporation. The President is the CEO and Congress is the Board of Directors. They are mostly concerned with keeping their jobs (getting re-elected) and making money (donations, campaign funds, bribes, etc).

 

On that point, I agree wholeheartedly. Curiously though, the right is anti-government, yet pro-corporation. Doesn't make much sense. I guess they get mad because someone else is cuttin' in on their action. Two big mafia families.
The right's mafia doesn't even hand out turkeys on Thanksgiving though. Just pink slips and mergers.

 

And the left is pro-government but anti-corporation. An odd system we have. Of course, the politicians on the right still suck at the teet of the government just like the politicians on the left still suck at the teet of the corporations. They just each try to hide it from us.

 

Be nice if there was one that represented regular folks, but that's just a pipedream I suppose. Can't have mega profits for the few and feed everybody I guess. Guess that's what hell is for..
Anybody investing in Haiti yet? Labor is cheap! Hey...maybe we could just hire them at a buck a day and build us a big golfcourse??

 

Bingo! Moens argument is telling us that since there are some dislikable aspects of the republican party, as middle class citizens, we should automatically vote for the democrat party and ignore whatever's wrong with it. Hmmmm. No thanks.

 

No, no, no, no, no.... It isn't a flip side. It's just an ignorant side that should not be praised. You're comparing apples and oranges. The goal of corporations is to make money and succeed. Yes, more is always better. There are stockholders relying on these companies to make them money for their retirements. Most of these stockholders are middle class people. Since this is the only feasible goal, how can you scold them? It's a free country. It's their choice to do with the profits as they wish. If people don't like it, they should stop working for that company if it's that unfair. If it's so bad, people should stop investing in that company.

Government is not a corporation. It is a non-profit entity that has a responsibility to dole out tax money to what is needed in a responsible manner for civilized society. They don't have to make a profit. Their only goal is to break even and they are failing miserably at that.
They should not be looked upon as having free will to do what they want with the money. That is YOUR money. My money. Everybody's money. When there's policies in place at every level of government to waste it or lose it, that is a plan for failure and should not be praised as being 'good' in comparison to corporations. People have no concept of how much tax money is wasted. They think they do but they really have no concept.

 

If you think corporations operate to make money for their stockholders, you might want to compare what your 401k has done in the last couple of years with the bonuses and salaries of the people heading those corporations.

Face it. A CEO and a President have the same goals...to keep their job and to make money and gain power. Same with Congress and the lower executives of a corporation. Whether the people (or the shareholders) prosper is only a secondary or tertiary consideration.

Both corporations and the government operate under limited (or no) liability rules. Both have the rights of 'Super People'. Corporations exist because of the special laws that have been created for them by politicians. And, in turn, the politicians are funded by the corporations and told what to do by the corporations.

It may not be the way it should be but it is the way I see it being.