Edward Snowden - Hero or Trader, Your Opinion

View attachment 1739
This photo provided by The Guardian Newspaper in London shows Edward Snowden, who worked as a contract employee at the National Security Agency, on Sunday, June 9, 2013, in Hong Kong. The Guardian identified Snowden as a source for its reports on intelligence programs after he asked the newspaper to do so on Sunday.

 

Trader?

 

It's a simple question. Ignore the typo and just answer.

 

We first need to decide if Snowden is a "whistleblower" (ala Linda Tripp who exposed perjury during the Clinton/Lewinsky investigation) or a "traitor" (ala Bradley Manning who gave information to America's enemies).

In Snowden's case, it's probable that the Obama administration will view him as a traitor if they decide that he had intent to betray his country.

On the other hand, civil libertarians will probably view him as a whistleblower since he exposed the government's web of privacy invasion.

I suppose it comes down to a couple of choices: If you support the Obama administration, you'll view him as a traitor. If you support civil liberties, you'll view him as a hero. That is, of course, supposing that we know everything about this guy and his intent.

 

In his own words....

 

I need to get some more info before I decide if he is guilty or innocent. From the news I am getting, I am tending to innocent, but it is close.

 

He broke an oath to the government that he would not reveal state secrets, that makes him guilty. Is he a traitor? I have to say "Yes", due to the nature of what he did.

I don't consider him a hero for another reason: This type of information was bound to be leaked at some point, possibly even by accident. I go further and say that I already assumed the government could and would do this at some point, just like corporations do, and if people couldn't understand that before he revealed it as truth, that's on them.

In other words I'm calling this program an "open secret".

Comments from legislators hinted about it many times over the years, which in and of itself may be treasonous. They didn't go as far as this guy did, but they had no place commenting on it at all, IMO.

Personally, I'd like the Obama administration to coordinate with the Justice Department (or whoever) to conduct an investigation into these potential violations in the legislature. The reason being, they have security clearance that they shouldn't have, given that they reveal the existence of specific classified information as they see fit. They should never even be briefed, IMO, not when they can't keep their mouths shut. At the very least, they should lose the privilege of reviewing any classified information, because they can't be trusted with it.

That should be expressed publicly, and in Congress. "You have abused the privilege , the right, to know these secrets, as such you should be put in prison but your immunity to prosecution covers you in this case. But, we can't allow you access to that information anymore because you are indeed traitors. Go McCarthy yourselves."

 

I'd say I'm pretty much with rlm at this point but we DO need more information.

I'll add that I think you'll see a bit more of agreement by right and left on this one.

In addition I figure everyone here might consider the possibility that this has been going on like forever.

Factor in new technologies and it gets even easier.

Hell,
Maybe we should farm the info to the Chinese so they can tell us what we're doing.
If they don't already have the info that is.

 

I think Snowden did "us", you and I, a favor by exposing the extent of the surveillance policy that most people already believed was happening anyway. He didn't do the "US" a favor by revealing our surveillance tactics to our enemies. So I don't see this as all bad or all good depending on your perspective. My perspective is that he did both good and harm to the people of this country and should neither be considered a hero nor a traitor. He simply threw his life away for his principles and hopes for our understanding. Good luck in your future ventures Mr. Snowden...If you have a future.

 

You know, Anonymous has a point about open-secrets stuff, of not keeping secrets, but then again they don't actually abide by those principles themselves, and for good reason.

That's the nature of the argument.

All information should be open to the public, but it can't be.

One can't say to the other that they are completely wrong, since both try to reveal certain information and both attempt to keep certain information private.

FUBAR.

 

I missed our declaration of war on WikiLeaks. When did they become the enemy? Would it have been better in your opinion if Manning had spilled the beans to The Guardian and let them publicize it? You seem quite enamored of The Guardian lately.

 

I didn't know the government declared war on WikiLeaks. Did they? They certainly declared that Bradley Manning was an enemy. In fact, I'm surprised Overlord Obama didn't personally sign the order to drop a drone on his head.

How could one not love the Guardian? A liberal rag that's good for laughs that happens to get something right once in a while. It's like watching a Marx Brothers movie.

 

And you agree with the government's position, so what's your problem with Obama here?

 

Uhmmm.. exactly which government position do you think I'm agreeing with?

 

I thought that this was an interesting little bit of data...

View attachment 1746

 

Re-read the relevant posts and figure it out. If you can't figure it out or would prefer not to deal with it, that's fine. We'll move on. I haven't got time for the games and the back-and-forth this morning.

 

Neither have I. I certainly don't have time to tolerate your accusations.

 

Well there's no need to lash out

 

I don't have time to lash out

 

You have all day to argue nonsense but when you get pinned down, suddenly you "don't have time" to articulate a rational argument. How convenient!