Tax evasion or terrible business owner? Pick one

Discussion in 'Politics' started by GeneWright, Sep 27, 2020.

  1. GeneWright

    GeneWright Well-Known Member

    The NYT just released an article on Trump's tax returns from 2000-2017. Through that time, he paid around $2000 total in federal income tax. 2016 and 2017 were $750 each, and 2000-2015 had 10 years with $0 federal income tax. He accomplished this primarily by claiming massive losses against the taxes he owed, to the tune of ~$50,000,000 a year. Also notable, then Trump employee, Ivanka Trump, was listed as a consultant and consultant fees were deducted. Additionally, one year showed $70,000 in hairstyling deducted.

    So what's it going to be? He's either absolutely the worst business person to ever live driving every business into the ground, or he's been committing tax crimes. Those are the options here.
    FryDaddyJr likes this.
  2. GeneWright

    GeneWright Well-Known Member

    Also big, he owes over $300,000,000 in personal loans that will be required to pay back that he personally guaranteed for within the next couple years.

    Bigger, he has been getting hundreds of millions in loans from banks (presumably by claiming he had some way to pay them off) while simultaneously telling the IRS he was losing hundreds of millions and couldn't pay income tax. He was lying to one of them, which is illegal in either direction. Also of note, part of the reason he's under audit is a suspicious $72,000,000 tax refund he's trying to claim.

    Biggest, he's been making business deals since becoming president, despite claiming and promising not to. This includes multi million dollar hotel and golf course deals in Turkey and The Philippines.

    The takeaway, this guy will fight tooth and nail to stay president, because he's definitely going to jail once he's out.
  3. JoeNation

    JoeNation Patron Saint of Idiots

    I think if Trump had ever filed an honest tax return in his entire life, he wouldn't be trying as hard as he is to hide all of his tax returns and claim that he is ALWAYS being audited by the IRS. His past returns surely aren't still being audited? Release those like every other candidate has done.
    FryDaddyJr likes this.
  4. GeneWright

    GeneWright Well-Known Member

    He claimed as recently today that they are still being audited.
  5. toughcoins

    toughcoins Rarely is the liberal viewpoint tainted by realism

    You obviously have a lot to learn about tax law. Why don't you give Bern a call?
  6. GeneWright

    GeneWright Well-Known Member

    So you're opting for the terrible business owner route rather than the illegal one?
  7. toughcoins

    toughcoins Rarely is the liberal viewpoint tainted by realism

    No . . . neither.

    Something you evidently have yet to learn is that our behemoth tax code legally fosters structuring of the reinvestment of one’s profits to largely offset those profits in selected years to minimize tax liability. Taking advantage of this is hardly unique to Donald Trump. It’s done by all major corporations and most smaller businesses. Liberal darlings such as Tesla, ABC and Amazon are masters of this as well.

    After you’ve done your research, come back and let’s discuss a national flat tax . . . Something to which I never understood the liberal objection.
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2020
    JohnHamilton likes this.
  8. GeneWright

    GeneWright Well-Known Member

    Yes, I detest it when they all do it. However, he didn't use that method to get tax credits. He used the method of reporting constant astronomical business losses. Which is why the non-tax evasion route shows his terrible business prowess.

    For the record, liberals have full turned on at least Amazon and Tesla. Can't speak either way to ABC.
  9. FryDaddyJr

    FryDaddyJr Well-Known Member

    Amazon isn't a liberal darling. You're never right/
  10. FryDaddyJr

    FryDaddyJr Well-Known Member

    Ivanka Trump Could Be Going Down Thanks To Her Dad’s Tax Fraud

    Donald Trump’s tax returns show that he paid his daughter Ivanka as a consultant, even though she is a member of the company which is against IRS rules.

    Mr. Trump reduced his taxable income by treating a family member as a consultant, and then deducting the fee as a cost of doing business.

    The “consultants” are not identified in the tax records. But evidence of this arrangement was gleaned by comparing the confidential tax records to the financial disclosures Ivanka Trump filed when she joined the White House staff in 2017. Ms. Trump reported receiving payments from a consulting company she co-owned, totaling $747,622, that exactly matched consulting fees claimed as tax deductions by the Trump Organization for hotel projects in Vancouver and Hawaii

    Ms. Trump had been an executive officer of the Trump companies that received profits from and paid the consulting fees for both projects — meaning she appears to have been treated as a consultant on the same hotel deals that she helped manage as part of her job at her father’s business.

    Fake consulting deals with members of a company that is also managing the same project are a big red flag to the IRS. Trump hid income by listing his own daughter a consultant on projects that she was managing. In other words, Ivanka Trump and her father were cheating the United States government, and the American people to hide income and avoid paying taxes.

    The implications of Trump’s tax returns go far beyond his lies about his wealth and the potential tax fraud that he has committed for decades. It turns out that cheating the American people is part of the family business.

    Ivanka Trump has already been under investigation for potential tax crimes related to the 2016 presidential inauguration, but the scheme with her father could have greater implications. It clear that out of the Trump children Ivanka is the favorite who is being groomed as the political and business heir apparent to Trump.

    She also could share her father’s legal jeopardy, as daddy could be taking his little girl down with him for his decades of theft and fraud
    GeneWright likes this.
  11. FryDaddyJr

    FryDaddyJr Well-Known Member

    This tax avoidance sets him apart from most other affluent Americans.
    Taxes on wealthy Americans have declined sharply over the past few decades, and many use loopholes to reduce their taxes below the statutory rates. But most affluent people still pay a lot of federal income tax.

    In 2017, the average federal income rate for the highest-earning .001 percent of tax filers — that is, the most affluent 1/100,000th slice of the population — was 24.1 percent, according to the I.R.S.

    Over the past two decades, Mr. Trump has paid about $400 million less in combined federal income taxes than a very wealthy person who paid the average for that group each year.
    GeneWright likes this.
  12. GeneWright

    GeneWright Well-Known Member

    Here's a good one, he has been claiming $2.2 million in property tax deductions at one of his mansions. He's continued to do this after his own 2017 Tax Cuts and Jobs Act capped it at $10,000. He does this by claiming property taxes here as personal expenses. This is one of the primary subjects he is being investigated by the New York attorney general for
  13. toughcoins

    toughcoins Rarely is the liberal viewpoint tainted by realism

    Okay, so I see I’m a little behind the times concerning liberals regard for Amazon, but they are still a liberal organization, and still receive a great deal of liberal business.

    Doubtless, others such as Starbucks, Target and Nike handle budgeting and expenditures for, and calculation of their tax liabilities similarly.
  14. FryDaddyJr

    FryDaddyJr Well-Known Member

    so you're defending Trump never paying taxes and owing millions? How's that rabbit hole?
  15. toughcoins

    toughcoins Rarely is the liberal viewpoint tainted by realism

    No, I’m trying to get liberals to acquiesce and embrace a flat tax in lieu of the current tiered taxation with deductions that can be manipulated by anyone having good accountants and tax attorneys.

    What’s the best solution? . . . As always, keep it simple stupid!
  16. FryDaddyJr

    FryDaddyJr Well-Known Member

    so just whataboutism and no scrutiny of the rotten President.
  17. toughcoins

    toughcoins Rarely is the liberal viewpoint tainted by realism

    What the president pays for taxes has no bearing on his ability to steer this nation straight, but since you liberals seem intent on getting me to give an answer in that regard, here it is . . .

    Mr. Trump’s ability to minimize his liability within the confines of existing tax law demonstrates conscious planning, management and attainment of goals in a very complex field. Such skills have been largely absent among many of our past leaders . . . Especially the pure politicians.
    Mopar Dude likes this.
  18. FryDaddyJr

    FryDaddyJr Well-Known Member

    but he's been caught actually. Didn't you read the article?
  19. GeneWright

    GeneWright Well-Known Member

    If only he'd kept it within existing tax law.

    Sidenote because you keep coming back to it, I could be okay with a flat tax, but it's going to have to be like 40% and offer better protections for the lower class.
  20. toughcoins

    toughcoins Rarely is the liberal viewpoint tainted by realism

    40% is a bullshit number . . . We’re not opening the floodgates for you profligate spenders . . . 18% will work great.

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